In this episode, Mary Catherine gives the low down on what dopamine is, what is good about it, and when you might be getting too much of it. The brain is an awesome organ! We also look at why getting easy dopamine might not always be the best idea and that doing a dopamine detox can be a good idea.
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Chris: [00:00:00] On today's episode, we're going to talk about dopamine, how awesome it is and how we all probably have too much of it in our lives.
Well, hello everybody. This is Chris.
Mary Catherine: [00:00:34] And this is Mary Catherine.
Chris: [00:00:35] Again, you paused a little bit there.
Mary Catherine: [00:00:37] I know.
Chris: [00:00:38] Why do you pause between the time I introduce you?
Mary Catherine: [00:00:41] Because you're supposed to say this is Chris and next to me is my beautiful sidekick. Mary Catherine.
Chris: [00:00:49] I could do that. And I've done that before. I didn't know. It was a requirement every episode now
Mary Catherine: [00:00:54] I just, with COVID and us not going out well with us, not going out.
I just love the way you tell people nice things about
Chris: [00:01:04] Ladies and gentlemen, my beautiful cohost.
Mary Catherine: [00:01:08] Ah, thank you, you're the best.
Chris: [00:01:10] Mary Catherine
Does my voice sound weird on here today?
Mary Catherine: [00:01:13] No
Chris: [00:01:14] I feel like it's deeper than normal.
Mary Catherine: [00:01:16] You have a deep voice.
Chris: [00:01:17] I know, but I feel like it's deeper than normal today. I don't know.
I hope it comes out. Okay. And people can understand what I'm saying.
Mary Catherine: [00:01:23] I hope your voice stays deep. I like
Chris: [00:01:26] thank you very much.
Mary Catherine: [00:01:28] It is one of the things that attracted to me when I met attracted you to me when I met you.
Okay. That makes sense.
Chris: [00:01:36] Your, I guess voice, I like your voice, cause it kinda has a kind of, a smile or a
Mary Catherine: [00:01:42] laugh to it.
Chris: [00:01:44] It does. It has a, a tint of laughter in it.
Mary Catherine: [00:01:48] Really? I think so. What if about if I'm talking about something serious and I have this fool,
Chris: [00:01:54] it's still, if I close my eyes, I still feel like you're smiling.
Mary Catherine: [00:01:57] Like I'm up to something or that I'm jovial,
Chris: [00:02:00] that you're jovial.
Mary Catherine: [00:02:01] Okay.
Chris: [00:02:06] not juvenile, but like you are a trickster,
Mary Catherine: [00:02:10] you're not wrong.
Chris: [00:02:13] like I mentioned, we're going to talk about dopamine today and you are a resident expert because you are a neural educator by trade. And I am just a simple lay person.
Mary Catherine: [00:02:28] You're essential. Don't ever forget it.
Chris: [00:02:31] I'm what, Oh, I thought you said I'm essential.
Mary Catherine: [00:02:36] Essential. Yes.
Chris: [00:02:37] I am essential. but I'm not nearly as smart as you are. So I'm five. You're here to walk us through, all this stuff.
Mary Catherine: [00:02:47] The litmus test for smart should be how well you can explain why NAB to me.
Chris: [00:02:52] yes.
why now for those of you that don't know what that is.
Mary Catherine: [00:02:56] That's true. This is another thing I always do. I say something and then I depend on you to. Inform people of what it is. Yes. So
Chris: [00:03:04] on, on the side, one of my side hustles is I am a financial coach, but I am mostly, into budgeting and we use a budgeting software called you need a budget. which works awesome.
It's called for short. Why NAB? so that's what Mary was talking about. we try not to have inside jokes on the podcast, but Mary doesn't understand that. Not everybody that's listening around the world knows
who we are and everything we think about.
Mary Catherine: [00:03:34] That's true. I'm horrible at that.
Chris: [00:03:36] She thinks
Mary Catherine: [00:03:36] we're famous.
No, I think that everybody just knows what I'm talking about.
Chris: [00:03:43] speaking about all the way around the world and the internets and all that stuff. dopamine is a good thing, you
Mary Catherine: [00:03:51] said. Sure. It can be.
Chris: [00:03:53] And is it created, what is it exactly?
Mary Catherine: [00:03:56] It's a chemical in your brain.
Chris: [00:03:58] And how does it get there?
Mary Catherine: [00:04:00] your brain makes it and you can give it to other people. You can be a dope, dealer and it's actually a joke. Yes. It's a nerdy.
Chris: [00:04:10] That's very dope.
Mary Catherine: [00:04:12] yeah, it's a. It's we like to incur when we teach students about the brain, we tell them what dopamine is and we encourage them to be dope. dealer.
Chris: [00:04:24] Oh, that's hilarious. I'm sure the parents really
Mary Catherine: [00:04:27] appreciate you
Chris: [00:04:29] equating their kids to drug dealers.
Mary Catherine: [00:04:32] But it is a good drug and it's a good thing to give to other people because it helps with like depression and all those things. And it helps you learn.
Chris: [00:04:43] Have I ever given you dopamine
Mary Catherine: [00:04:44] all the time?
Chris: [00:04:46] How do I, what have I done to give you
Mary Catherine: [00:04:48] when you belly laugh?
I get dopamine, or when you come give me a hug, I get dopamine interesting. Or if I give you a high five or you say you really did a good job, When I, if I'm speaking or singing or something, you'll be like, I really liked that last song or whatever it was, then you just say that's, being a dope dealer.
Chris: [00:05:10] Can you recall the last time I gave you a high five, that was the weirdest example you just chose. I don't recall ever giving you a high five.
Mary Catherine: [00:05:19] we're starting to unpack some things. This episode that may get us some, a family or marriage counselors leaving us messages. But anyway, norepinephrine. Is a drug that goes along with dopamine, chemical response in your brain, that I'm a big fan of norepinephrine.
And I know you are too.
Chris: [00:05:43] It is what it is.
Mary Catherine: [00:05:45] I'm about to tell you and you're going to be like, yeah, I love that stuff. Okay. Ready? When you anticipate it's the anticipatory state of something before it happens easy for you to
Chris: [00:05:56] say.
Mary Catherine: [00:05:57] So if you go gambling, yes. And you pull that lever.
Chris: [00:06:03] What lever I've never been
Mary Catherine: [00:06:04] because he shut up.
If you old, the old days, when is a lever instead of a button, right? When you pull that lever and those things are swirling and the musics and you haven't won or lost yet, then that moment your brain is releasing norepinephrine. Oh, And all the bells and whistles are releasing dopamine.
Chris: [00:06:23] So that's, so that is me anticipating what may or may not happen.
Mary Catherine: [00:06:28] And it can be good or bad. Okay. It's the anticipatory set. It's when you, here's an example that you will be able to understand in where it can be a good or a bad thing. So a teacher's in front of the class and there, back in the day, we could be in front of class and. They ask a question. Yeah. That moment meant that people put their hands up and you don't, but you know that there's a chance the teacher's going to call you anyway.
Chris: [00:06:54] Yeah. Yes. Oh, I hate that.
Mary Catherine: [00:06:56] That moment is an anticipation is norepinephrine is released. Now if you're a high anxiety kid, I've just as the teacher hijacked your amygdala.
Chris: [00:07:06] I have plenty of teachers hijacked
Mary Catherine: [00:07:08] my big dilemma, which is
Chris: [00:07:11] me. I could have said it by myself.
Mary Catherine: [00:07:13] I saw you preparing to say it.
So I thought I did that. Wanted to say it. Okay. McDilla can you spell it?
Chris: [00:07:18] A M Y. G O D O L a,
Mary Catherine: [00:07:24] but anyway, cause I just fill it without writing it down either, but amigdala is the part of your brain that's freeze, fight flight, some other central thing. And Fon is a new thing that we've been talking about in the neural ed circle.
And so it's basically your brain's way of protecting you. And so we've go into survival mode. So that's when you find out who needs to know the nurse or the bathroom or right. Cause right. They will try to escape it or they just will shut down and not answer the question. And so I bring that up because this has a lot to do with what we're going to talk about today in dopamine.
Chris: [00:08:07] Let me ask you this. Maybe you already answered it, but dopamine. Can dopamine be creative from bad things.
Mary Catherine: [00:08:15] Yes. If you're too stressed to stress. Yes. So if you're too stressed,
Chris: [00:08:20] so the dopamine is not all, so it can be bad
Mary Catherine: [00:08:23] well, or is it still a good has to do with your amygdala? Gotcha. Your amygdala commands the production of that excess, norepinephrine and dopamine under stressful conditions.
Okay. And so that in turn shuts down the functioning of your prefrontal cortex, but strengthens activity in the striatum and the amygdala. High levels of norepinephrine and dopamine in the prefrontal cortex switch on receptors that channels, the disconnect and links between prefrontal neurons, thus weakening the area's role in controlling emotions and impulses period.
Chris: [00:09:05] That sounded so smart.
Mary Catherine: [00:09:07] Thank you
Chris: [00:09:08] had that all memorized.
Mary Catherine: [00:09:10] I don't wanted to make sure that I said it correctly. Yes. You want me to, do you want me to say it in regular people's terms now? Yes, please. Okay. So when your. When your amygdala is hijacked and it produces too much norepinephrine and dopamine, you have a 16 year old boy, I don't know, say Harrison in tears for no reason.
Chris: [00:09:36] I ha I got it.
Mary Catherine: [00:09:37] That's what's happening?
Chris: [00:09:38] Yeah. I understand that completely.
Mary Catherine: [00:09:41] And also that happens to us in stressful situations where you're like, why can I not stop crying? Or why can I not stop? This other thing, when you want to get back into control of yourself, And that's why learning how to use brain breaks and do cross lateral brain activities to help yourself recenter, or know that when you need to take a break or how to get yeah, you're a brain back under control is very empowering for students and teachers.
Because if I see a kid doing that, I know. What's happening in his brain, It's not an act of defiance. That student is not trying to be naughty. They're not trying to play you. Their brain is hijacked right now. Wow. Yeah. Yeah.
Chris: [00:10:28] so talking about the good things about dopamine. So just for the listeners and for me too, some good things might be like, say maybe if I was eating my favorite food,
Mary Catherine: [00:10:40] Which could be bad too,
Chris: [00:10:41] right?
Yeah. But it could give me that hit of dopamine.
Mary Catherine: [00:10:44] Does that make you feel, does it
Chris: [00:10:45] taste and
Mary Catherine: [00:10:47] obviously, and it reminds you of your grandma. Yeah. And it's because this. Fun brain fact, you set this episode up for this didn't you fun brain facts. the sense of smell is the only thing that can pass. Go pot, go beyond the amygdala.
Huh? The, without. Stopping. It's like the, you got that car to the monopoly bore. This is go straight to get gel. Don't stop or go straight wherever and don't stop somewhere. I don't know. I don't play monopoly. That's the other Mary Pilon. another inside family joke. We'll explain later, but that, yeah.
What you said.
Chris: [00:11:27] Interesting. so there's a lot of good things that you could do that would cause that dopamine hit.
Just like having a great social interaction with somebody conversation. Yes. I'm seeing a beautiful woman picture or a picture. Yeah, that's fine.
Mary Catherine: [00:11:43] Good Lord. Or a beautiful man.
Chris: [00:11:44] Yeah. those would, those might give you that dopamine,
Mary Catherine: [00:11:47] right? And if I, if you said I got you, another puppy looks just like Gracie, That would be a dopamine hit. That would. Have rewards. Yes.
Chris: [00:11:57] so do you remember, we watched a movie just a couple of weeks ago called the social dilemma, and if you haven't watched it, everybody out there, if you haven't watched it, I think it's on Netflix.
If I remember correct. And it's a movie it's a documentary about, it's called the social dilemma. It's about social media basically, and how it is controlling us and how it's taking information from us. Through our constant, viewing of it, either Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, tic talk, Snapchat, whatever they're called all
Mary Catherine: [00:12:30] those things.
Chris: [00:12:30] YouTube, for example. And how they're doing this is so I would almost say diabolical, because companies, these companies, Are coming after us. They're not necessarily, per se trying to get our money they're trying to get
Mary Catherine: [00:12:48] right. Because that makes them money. Yeah.
Chris: [00:12:50] Make some money.
So it's not about money. Like it used to be. They just want to keep us glued to them. Glued to Facebook, glued to YouTube going down that rabbit hole on YouTube. Which I've done a million times. And they're just wanting us to do that because it's manipulating that chemical, That dopamine in our brains.
Mary Catherine: [00:13:08] and the norepinephrine, because, so I'm 16 years old. I post something on Instagram or Snapchat and I sit and wait for my likes or the responses.
Chris: [00:13:21] And what if you don't get them? maybe the picture was not good enough. I'm going to delete that one, take another picture and see what happens now.
Mary Catherine: [00:13:28] Yeah, because it's, we don't operate the same as our children operate. So while ago Harrison was like, we're looking at his Instagram. He hasn't had any pictures on there. We're like, I thought you had a bunch of pictures on here. He said, no, I deleted them. And I was like, why you took the right? Which isn't something we do.
We take a picture, we put it on there, we leave it there.
Chris: [00:13:48] I want to look at it years from now.
Mary Catherine: [00:13:50] Yeah. And And, like when we were kids, all your pictures, when you're kids, you think they look great until you're a little bit older and then you're like, that's dumb, right? who let me out of the house and those pants or who, that haircut, that perm didn't work out so well.
Chris: [00:14:06] Why did you have to bring up?
Mary Catherine: [00:14:07] I got a perm too. When I got firm's. When I was young,
Chris: [00:14:10] I'm going to post those on the website, by the way, perms of Mary's perms.
Mary Catherine: [00:14:14] Oh, only if I can put yours on there. Mexican Gregg. Braden. Anyway, you looked good with the permit.
Chris: [00:14:23] Thank you very much.
Mary Catherine: [00:14:24] Anyway, that's that norepinephrine.
And that's where an example where it could be good or bad.
Chris: [00:14:30] So there is a dark side of dopamine,
Mary Catherine: [00:14:33] And that's why they have the little bubble with the dots.
Chris: [00:14:37] Yeah. Oh, on the text messages
Mary Catherine: [00:14:40] on Facebook. Yeah. cause I don't want to leave you hanging. So sometimes you'll read a message of mine and you'll.
It'll look like you're gonna type something and then I wait now that's my time and energy. Yep. And then you're like, I better not respond to that.
Which is my version of what I think you're thinking,
Chris: [00:15:00] but it keeps us glued.
Mary Catherine: [00:15:01] It keeps you glued to it. Yeah.
Chris: [00:15:03] It keeps us on the page. Yes.
Say if it's Facebook.
Mary Catherine: [00:15:06] Yeah. If I'm waiting for you
Chris: [00:15:07] to reply to me, cause I just said something hilarious, she's going to reply to this. She's going to love this. And I weighed and I see those dots flashing, right? Those are the neurons
Mary Catherine: [00:15:17] neuro epinephrin.
Chris: [00:15:18] Yes. And I'm waiting to be, to get my hit of dopamine.
that's a bad thing. it's a good thing once you get it, but I'm saying it's, it could be a bad thing if you're wasting time waiting,
Mary Catherine: [00:15:30] right? if you're anything that gets in the way of you living your life as an addiction, and it's a problem, whether it's your eating. You're drinking, you're smoking your drug use are, those are typical things that people think of, but internet addiction is a big thing and it causes physiological changes in the Adelaide.
Chris: [00:15:49] So let me say this. Okay. Obviously we have all this stuff in our lives, just in our face all the time. We have all these, things that are begging us for time and we're willing to give that time. Sure But this is one of those cases where dopamine can really hinder what you're doing it.
Would I study or do my homework or do my job? If I can get five more minutes on YouTube and watch a cool video. Yeah. Because I'm not going to get dopamine from a working on a spreadsheet more than likely,
Mary Catherine: [00:16:26] Unless you're a nerd,
Chris: [00:16:29] but I am going to get five minutes of I'm going to get some dopamine from watching a five minute video about how awesome Larry Bird is.
Mary Catherine: [00:16:36] Yes. And you may get dopamine from that spreadsheet, but it's delayed dopamine
Chris: [00:16:41] once I've turned it in,
Mary Catherine: [00:16:43] you turned it in or you're in a meeting in a conference, but
Chris: [00:16:46] that could be months away.
Mary Catherine: [00:16:47] And that's that's a prefrontal cortex thing.
Chris: [00:16:50] We know
Mary Catherine: [00:16:51] this,
Chris: [00:16:52] if you're smart, like you are, or even if you're not so smart, but married somebody smart, like I did, that this dopamine is, can be a great thing, but it can also hijack your amygdala
Mary Catherine: [00:17:06] yes.
Chris: [00:17:08] make you do things
Mary Catherine: [00:17:10] that you should consciously, unless you're totally aware of it.
Chris: [00:17:12] So this is, I read an article about this that I think is very important.
Mary Catherine: [00:17:17] Okay.
Chris: [00:17:18] I think that a lot of people are, as the social dilemma movie even showed us or told us a lot of people are addicted to the social media stuff, just because of that dopamine that they continuously get.
how can you, I see you're disagreeing with that.
Mary Catherine: [00:17:37] Keep talking.
Chris: [00:17:38] how can we ask, our podcast this week is called, we do hard things. How can you do hard things if you're constantly on Facebook or Twitter, Instagram, and that's all you do because you're constantly looking for those dopamine hits and that's all you want.
That's all you want.
Mary Catherine: [00:17:57] If it interferes with your life and doing your life, then it's a problem.
Chris: [00:18:02] Isn't five minutes enough to take away from your life. I'm not, and I'm not saying I'm going to give up Facebook,
Mary Catherine: [00:18:09] Twitter,
Chris: [00:18:10] but I'm saying, I think I should probably cut it in half. At
Mary Catherine: [00:18:14] least there are times that you should definitely not be doing it.
I w. If you find yourself driving down the road and you have to check Facebook while you're driving down the road. I don't do that. You've got a problem.
Chris: [00:18:28] I've never done that.
Mary Catherine: [00:18:29] But I just think that, there are the article that you're talking about. Talked about, hi, what did they say? Hi. Hold on.
Chris: [00:18:42] what I was trying to say is
Mary Catherine: [00:18:43] passive high dopamine activities. So passive high dopamine activity is our Facebook and whatever. So you need to replace those. You need to replace those with activities in which you have to work a little bit and which toxic, which ties into what you brought up last week.
Like working harder to get. Success. So when I take Gracie out and throw the ball for her, I'm getting dopamine from Gracie, especially when she jumps up and Greg gets it in the air and twist her body around stuff. It's pretty amazing. So I'm getting dopamine in that way. Okay. If I, but when I look at Facebook and I'm.
Sitting with you and Gracie and we're watching a movie or something I'm passively getting a dopamine hit, but I'm not really engaged with Facebook, you Gracie or the movie. Gotcha. So that's a passive suck, right? If you like, if it was Harry Potter, it would be those things that come and take your soul.
yeah, go ahead.
Chris: [00:19:52] No, what I wanted to get to, I wanted to get to this whole idea of a dopamine detox. You say dope means good and the, in the right ways, but if you're doing it on Facebook or Instagram or Twitter or whatever, and you're doing it constantly and you can't do anything else with your life.
But that I think it might be a good time to have a detox of those things.
Mary Catherine: [00:20:14] So this is where my problem is. You've been watching me make the face here for about five minutes. I have a pro. So I think it's click cause they're talking about dopamine detox, like they're trying to get you, but they're not really talking about the dopamine part there while they're talking about dopamine and it's impact on your behavior.
And the passive thing. So I think that if you take things out of your life that are passive, And do a detox of that. But I think that the title for that would be passive dopamine detox, which would be dumb. So I just think that you need that. We need to do things where we're moving or we're engaging with something tactically.
That's why reading a book or being with family or laughing or playing a board game. Those things are all dopamine dealers as well. Instead of the little kid computer that we have in our hand all the time.
Chris: [00:21:08] Yeah. So I think the way it was phrased in the article, if I remember correctly, was it, their idea was to remove easy dopamine from your life for 24 hours.
I think that's would count as a detox.
Mary Catherine: [00:21:22] Absolutely.
Chris: [00:21:23] And then replace high dopamine activities with there. difficult, but worthwhile low dopamine counterparts parts. What would a low dopamine counterpart to say YouTube video watching all day? What would that be?
Mary Catherine: [00:21:39] painting, yard work.
Chris: [00:21:42] Gotcha.
Mary Catherine: [00:21:43] going for a walk with your wife, right? I'm throwing the ball for the dog. calling your mom. unless she complained to you all the time, calling your mom calling, go and getting flowers and going, seeing somebody, Cause then you're giving them dopamine and then they're getting dopamine from, it's a given, it's a reciprocal thing.
They have. The other thing is if you give me dopamine, I am, you're also getting dopamine and return. It's not a one way. Like I have a cookie, I'm going to give you my cookie. It's like I have a cookie, but my cookie turns into a cookie for you too. That's how dopamine works.
Chris: [00:22:20] going with this whole article about the dopamine detox, they're talking about just trying to do it for 24 hours, right?
So what do we do or what do I do? The first thing I do when I wake up in the morning, usually
Mary Catherine: [00:22:32] you look at your phone.
Chris: [00:22:33] I look at my phone. I want to see if I missed any calls during the middle of the night for work. I want to see if there's any emails and I need to jump on right away. They're saying don't check your phone.
Don't go on your computer. Don't watch TV for an entire 24 hours
Mary Catherine: [00:22:48] or eat sugar,
Chris: [00:22:49] no eating sugar or fatty foods. No junk foods, right? Yep. And then it says, but you can, talk to people for walks. Like you said, meditate journal with a pen and paper, not on the computer. Yep.
Mary Catherine: [00:23:04] Go to a paint, go for a bike,
Chris: [00:23:06] Go for a bike ride. And you're probably going to even says in the article, you might be bored out of your mind by the end of that day. Or maybe you'll feel uncomfortable, but maybe you'll feel a lot better. Yeah. So I think I would suggest I would even encourage people, including you. Let me
Mary Catherine: [00:23:24] check finger pointer over here on the bottom.
Chris: [00:23:26] They can't see I'm pointing my finger on the,
Mary Catherine: [00:23:32] I need them to have my back on this.
Chris: [00:23:34] I think they, I think that I would encourage people to maybe even try this. And I know that we hear this in the media all the time. Oh, you got to give up Facebook for lent or you got to give up, Twitter for a week or whatever it's going to they'll make you a better person.
But chemically, I think it might be,
Mary Catherine: [00:23:51] it will help you. It will help you for sure. And our children have gone on trips with, groups for weeks at a time and there's no phones. And the location that they were at, there's no cell service. So even if they had their phone, they would be up a Creek.
And they have always come back from those trips. I don't like my phone. I felt so much better without my phone. And something that you and I do did as children. That aren't shit. that Harrison struggled with that I noticed. and since covert happened, he's gone back to being able to do it more, but.
is to go, yeah, I don't have anything going on. What do I do? Like we never had a problem when nothing was going on. I'm out of here. I'm going to go play. I'll be back at dark. I will, I got to get on my bike. I got to pack a lunch. I'm out of here. I'm going to go play in the woods or I'm going to go whatever.
And, And you probably played lots of basketball, right? So there was always something going on that we could just invent and this generation, unless it's planned out for them or given to them, or, there's so much that's taking their brain. That it re that these days of detox, maybe it's a Sunday, a day arrest for rail away from electronics, would be good.
Chris: [00:25:13] they're also saying in this article that, for every hour that you spend on low dopamine activities,
Mary Catherine: [00:25:19] walking,
Chris: [00:25:20] exercising, riding a bike, throw in 15 minutes of that pass of high. Dopamine stuff like Facebook or that just goes into the whole idea of how much screen time should we have,
Mary Catherine: [00:25:32] right.
Chris: [00:25:33] not just as kids, but as adults too.
Mary Catherine: [00:25:35] Yeah.
Chris: [00:25:36] And I can't see how that wouldn't change your life dramatically if you were able to do that.
Mary Catherine: [00:25:41] I know as a student, I can't maintain the level of social media. Right or Pokemon that I would, if I wasn't a student. And so being an adult student, I can tell you that it takes a little transition for me to get back in the swing of things, of being a student again.
And so my empathy goes to these kids who need to get back in the swing of school again, and where they're putting, where they're budgeting their time. Awesome.
Chris: [00:26:19] thanks. for your input on their, expert, dopamine expert lady,
Mary Catherine: [00:26:24] I there's still so much to learn.
Chris: [00:26:26] I'm sure we'll jump into this topic again.
At some point, as this, whole idea of social media is always in our face and a big part of our educational system
Mary Catherine: [00:26:39] and our
Chris: [00:26:40] kids' lives and in our lives too. And I'm sure we'll talk about it again.
Mary Catherine: [00:26:46] We will. can I say something? Yeah. I don't usually have to ask them if I can say something, but he's in charge of all the buttons.
I really want to wish everyone a safe week this week and, stay healthy where you're mass be kind to people spread some dopamine, be a dopamine dealer.
Chris: [00:27:07] That's nice. Thanks.
Mary Catherine: [00:27:09] You're welcome.
Chris: [00:27:12] that's our show for today. Everybody. Thank you for being with us. We hope that you learned something. We hope that you thought it was funny.
And, we hope that you'll join us again on our next episode next Monday. if you'd like to get in touch with us, please check us out on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, YouTube, all at WD HT podcast. we hope to hear from you soon. Take care.